I stumbled across this article on AZ Central. I have no idea if this news outlet slants what politically, but they have tallied up all of the costs and benefits of illegals in AZ and it's just astounding. I know the wage quote is accurate for I've read those Academic papers previously (and I even checked the math!) but a lot of this I had no idea and it looks like they have grabbed the data straight from the gov. statistics, so I don't think they are making this up. Yoozer.
Last legitimate estimate I read of CA was about $11 billion per year in net costs.
Supposedly the inflation for food is about 10¢ if one paid a living wage instead of slave for AG workers. (i.e. trivial, the labor is a minor aspect of total supply costs).
I've seen his work and generally he makes valid assumptions and cranks the numbers, i.e. he didn't get this estimate by "past experience".
Then, South Korea's PPP is still way below the U.S., i.e. they can manufacture much more cheaply than the U.S.
On NAFTA, I believe people have pointed out jobs went to Canada, but due to the massive influx of cheap labor from S. of the border, for wages did not rise, unemployment did and Mexican factory workers were literally living in cardboard boxes, the tendency is to focus on Mexico.
It's only recently that the Canadian dollar was on par with the U.S., but it's clear their overall policies are creating jobs and they did not labor arbitrage their workforce like the U.S. and Mexico have done.
Scott's conclusions are based on "previous experience" with free trade agreements, e.g., NAFTA, that have little or nothing in common with the KORUS FTA.
He completely fails to consider that South Korea is a developed country with a well-paid and well-treated labor force. No American company would gain any economic benefit from off-shoring jobs to Korea.
NAFTA is accused (debatably) of sending American jobs to Mexico. But does anyone claim that it send jobs to Canada?
I changed the link to the actual post and author from their site. It appears Before It's News is simply republishing people's writings, making money off of them and making sure there isn't too much link back to the site/content owner/author so they actually get some pieces of silver for their article.
I don't think we are going to have a double dip and my reasoning laid out here is why.
I think we're going to get a de facto Depression. The NBER won't label depressions but by the technicals, what I see if the U.S. never recovered, if one looks at all of the indicators the NBER does, the economy never returned to pre-recession levels. So, there is no "high" to "dip from", unlike the 1980-1983 period.
So, instead of a double dip, I suspect the NBER will more the recession dates forward and that by definition would be a Depression.
Howz that one for Doom & Gloom by the numbers?
What I am about to blow my own stack over is over and over we see various people claim employment is a lagging indicator. Well, that's true, but it's also a co-incident indicator, because it has immediate impact on other aspects of the economy.
So, to me we have a jobs emergency, it's a national crisis and this government is just acting "la de da" and refusing to act on it. There are so many ways they could dig up immediate jobs and most of these don't add a dime to the deficit.
Prime Minister George Papandreou's socialist government easily passed the bill, which is key to a 110 billion euro ($138 billion) EU/IMF bailout and seen by experts as necessary to rescue a doomed social security system.
In other words the IMF and the EU are forcing Greece to screw the workers. Uh, anyone anywhere see the evidence that it is the social safety nets instead of LBOs and currency default swaps, lease deals and so on that caused the Greek debt crisis? We need a good accurate analysis of where the money really went.
I have bits and pieces in Instapopulists around that there were funky deals with Goldman Sachs, a series of lease type loans and so on, but no "pie chart" on the real breakdown or any evidence their social safety net system is a large percentage or what percentage of the national debt.
The pension bill also incorporates clauses that make it easier and cheaper to fire workers and allow firms to pay young first hires less than the minimum wage.
Also raising minimum retirement age to 65, similar to how in the U.S. if you're over 40 you're screwed on health insurance as well as subject to age discrimination, yet can't get anything until you're 65.
Hard to find any real details but it looks like they slashed pension benefits. Nice huh, you're counting on retirement income and with one vote, they take it away?
I know what you're saying it true and it's disgusting that hard working, even college educated, highly skilled are going to poverty, homelessness and hunger.
I'm not doing so well myself. You might consider trying to get food stamps, that's about all that's left these days in terms of any help frankly but at least it can buy some food.
I'm pissed too, as you can probably tell from my recent 10,600,000 jobs post. This is a national emergency and people absolutely must get income and they should do whatever it takes and on top of it, put the citizens this government is responsible for 1st.
I saw those same headlines, oh gee, could it be the official unemployment rate doesn't actually measure those wanting and needing a job? Then, the IMF is clearly running some neo-con agenda of screwing the middle classes and working classes by using a "crisis" to attack social safety nets.
That's the bottom line midtowng, now that the Banksters got the money they are out to further screw the citizens, the taxpayers and make sure they are homeless and poverty striken.
There are a host of other policies that would really help get some jobs fast that this administration refuses to do, those daily events are usually up in the Instapopulist, such as refusing to deal with China's currency manipulation, which supposedly could pass Congress (shock!)
I am one of those nameless, faceless millions that has been abruptly cut-off of unemployment that you were talking about and I am outraged at how congress is treating us. I am a college graduate and have worked hard all my life. Congress is sticking their middle finger up at us. I just paid my rent with the last money in my account. I am going to be 2 months behind on utilities. I have my last $20 to eat for the rest of the week….my bank account will then say $0. I am holding my breath for July 12th.
THIRD WORLD COUNTRY?
My cousin is a college educated Lan Administrator and certified computer person and his has been pounding the pavement like an animal for a job. His unemployment benefits got cut at the worst time and he is now losing his apartment so he has to move in with my aunt, uncle and her daughter and 3 kids…I feel like I am having a bad dream.
My brother… a hard working AMERICAN…is losing his business of many years…his marriage has fallen apart and he will now have to move into the basement of a fellow college mate until he can back on his feet.
My Father, who worked harder than any person I know his whole life…just lost his house and had to move in with my sister and her husband and 4 kids…along with my other 2 sisters. They are living on top of each other. This is UNPRECEDENTED for anyone in my family!
EVERYONE I KNOW who is out of work is desperately trying to get work! AMERICANS ARE NOT LAZY!!!!
I am livid!!!!!!
Sorry about that. It's google ads and often there are some incredibly bad advertisers who manage to get on the site. When I see 'em, I ban 'em, but they show up at random.
It's just to help pay for the site costs, so don't take some sexist ad seriously and please do use the contact form so I can catch 'em and then ban 'em.
Unfortunately Google is not picky enough on advertisers.
It sure would be a lot easier to take the columns in your web site seriously if I didn't have to view a reclining woman in a tight tank top the whole time, even with trying to resize the screen. advertising a shirt, or wtf??? Jesus.
Politics has been so entangled in Economics for 160 years that Marx wrote the "Critique of Political Economy" to try to show the inseparability one from the other. No one has been able to separate History and Economics. Some call History "past politics". History is threaded into all the writings of Ricardo and Smith as well.
Are you serious?
Politics and Immigration are everywhere on EP and in news. Im talking elector politics,
outsourcing, immigration, H1Bs averywhere
"
n this site, I'm pretty much determined to stay out of the politics on this, it's such an insane topic and stick to labor econ. I'm also not going to deny that population, immigration does indeed affect labor markets
.
"
in Federal Reserve private debt purchases to "help" the economy.
Krugman does an overview on what the Fed could do to "help" the economy, but frankly I still do not get, beyond buying up, reducing principle on consumer/residential mortgages that goes directly into debt relief for the middle class, how buying up worthless MBS and other securitized loans, which as far as I am aware, do not "trickle down" to the poor smuck (individual) who is stuck with the debt...helps "the economy".
This post has become popular on the Internets, so those reading it, give me a calculated answer on how buying more securitized derivatives, even MBS and consumer loans helps the economy for I don't see any of this helping the U.S. labor force, the U.S. middle class.
This is a classic, we have a Bankster representative, running against Carolyn Maloney because she dared to defend the Consumer Financial Protection Agency.
At least you know what you're voting for and they are pouring gobs of money into this primary. I always thought instead of Democrat/Republican, Congressional and Senate seats should be marked, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan Chase, Oracle, Microsoft and so on.
The resume is our classic point by point Wall Street agenda. Three Hedge funds and spinning global labor arbitrage as discrimination to boot, so you can have your Wall Street nightmare and unlimited global labor arbitrage all in one!
Poor poor Wall Street, they have been so maligned! (sic)
Considering we cannot get corporate tax code changes to stop making it more profitable to offshore outsource jobs and production overseas, I completely agree with you. There is no doubt they would pass something for even more incentives to invest and create jobs overseas. This government is too corrupt to actually change the law or make investment in the U.S. more favorable. But I think claiming businesses are not re-investing because the economic outlook isn't too rosy (which is very true) is ignoring the recent history of these corporations hording cash for quarterly earnings and executive compensation.
But yeah, we cannot get this government to pass anything that's a change, even with a financial Armageddon under their belt.
Haven't heard from you for while so very glad to see your comment!
I stumbled across this article on AZ Central. I have no idea if this news outlet slants what politically, but they have tallied up all of the costs and benefits of illegals in AZ and it's just astounding. I know the wage quote is accurate for I've read those Academic papers previously (and I even checked the math!) but a lot of this I had no idea and it looks like they have grabbed the data straight from the gov. statistics, so I don't think they are making this up. Yoozer.
Last legitimate estimate I read of CA was about $11 billion per year in net costs.
Supposedly the inflation for food is about 10¢ if one paid a living wage instead of slave for AG workers. (i.e. trivial, the labor is a minor aspect of total supply costs).
Well like you said, it comes down to taxes (and if they had brains...tariffs!).
I've seen his work and generally he makes valid assumptions and cranks the numbers, i.e. he didn't get this estimate by "past experience".
Then, South Korea's PPP is still way below the U.S., i.e. they can manufacture much more cheaply than the U.S.
On NAFTA, I believe people have pointed out jobs went to Canada, but due to the massive influx of cheap labor from S. of the border, for wages did not rise, unemployment did and Mexican factory workers were literally living in cardboard boxes, the tendency is to focus on Mexico.
It's only recently that the Canadian dollar was on par with the U.S., but it's clear their overall policies are creating jobs and they did not labor arbitrage their workforce like the U.S. and Mexico have done.
Scott's conclusions are based on "previous experience" with free trade agreements, e.g., NAFTA, that have little or nothing in common with the KORUS FTA.
He completely fails to consider that South Korea is a developed country with a well-paid and well-treated labor force. No American company would gain any economic benefit from off-shoring jobs to Korea.
NAFTA is accused (debatably) of sending American jobs to Mexico. But does anyone claim that it send jobs to Canada?
I changed the link to the actual post and author from their site. It appears Before It's News is simply republishing people's writings, making money off of them and making sure there isn't too much link back to the site/content owner/author so they actually get some pieces of silver for their article.
I don't think we are going to have a double dip and my reasoning laid out here is why.
I think we're going to get a de facto Depression. The NBER won't label depressions but by the technicals, what I see if the U.S. never recovered, if one looks at all of the indicators the NBER does, the economy never returned to pre-recession levels. So, there is no "high" to "dip from", unlike the 1980-1983 period.
So, instead of a double dip, I suspect the NBER will more the recession dates forward and that by definition would be a Depression.
Howz that one for Doom & Gloom by the numbers?
What I am about to blow my own stack over is over and over we see various people claim employment is a lagging indicator. Well, that's true, but it's also a co-incident indicator, because it has immediate impact on other aspects of the economy.
So, to me we have a jobs emergency, it's a national crisis and this government is just acting "la de da" and refusing to act on it. There are so many ways they could dig up immediate jobs and most of these don't add a dime to the deficit.
But instead they refuse to do so!
Greece strike:
In other words the IMF and the EU are forcing Greece to screw the workers. Uh, anyone anywhere see the evidence that it is the social safety nets instead of LBOs and currency default swaps, lease deals and so on that caused the Greek debt crisis? We need a good accurate analysis of where the money really went.
I have bits and pieces in Instapopulists around that there were funky deals with Goldman Sachs, a series of lease type loans and so on, but no "pie chart" on the real breakdown or any evidence their social safety net system is a large percentage or what percentage of the national debt.
Also raising minimum retirement age to 65, similar to how in the U.S. if you're over 40 you're screwed on health insurance as well as subject to age discrimination, yet can't get anything until you're 65.
Hard to find any real details but it looks like they slashed pension benefits. Nice huh, you're counting on retirement income and with one vote, they take it away?
Welcome to the United States Greece.
I know what you're saying it true and it's disgusting that hard working, even college educated, highly skilled are going to poverty, homelessness and hunger.
I'm not doing so well myself. You might consider trying to get food stamps, that's about all that's left these days in terms of any help frankly but at least it can buy some food.
I'm pissed too, as you can probably tell from my recent 10,600,000 jobs post. This is a national emergency and people absolutely must get income and they should do whatever it takes and on top of it, put the citizens this government is responsible for 1st.
I saw those same headlines, oh gee, could it be the official unemployment rate doesn't actually measure those wanting and needing a job? Then, the IMF is clearly running some neo-con agenda of screwing the middle classes and working classes by using a "crisis" to attack social safety nets.
That's the bottom line midtowng, now that the Banksters got the money they are out to further screw the citizens, the taxpayers and make sure they are homeless and poverty striken.
There are a host of other policies that would really help get some jobs fast that this administration refuses to do, those daily events are usually up in the Instapopulist, such as refusing to deal with China's currency manipulation, which supposedly could pass Congress (shock!)
I am one of those nameless, faceless millions that has been abruptly cut-off of unemployment that you were talking about and I am outraged at how congress is treating us. I am a college graduate and have worked hard all my life. Congress is sticking their middle finger up at us. I just paid my rent with the last money in my account. I am going to be 2 months behind on utilities. I have my last $20 to eat for the rest of the week….my bank account will then say $0. I am holding my breath for July 12th.
THIRD WORLD COUNTRY?
My cousin is a college educated Lan Administrator and certified computer person and his has been pounding the pavement like an animal for a job. His unemployment benefits got cut at the worst time and he is now losing his apartment so he has to move in with my aunt, uncle and her daughter and 3 kids…I feel like I am having a bad dream.
My brother… a hard working AMERICAN…is losing his business of many years…his marriage has fallen apart and he will now have to move into the basement of a fellow college mate until he can back on his feet.
My Father, who worked harder than any person I know his whole life…just lost his house and had to move in with my sister and her husband and 4 kids…along with my other 2 sisters. They are living on top of each other. This is UNPRECEDENTED for anyone in my family!
EVERYONE I KNOW who is out of work is desperately trying to get work! AMERICANS ARE NOT LAZY!!!!
I am livid!!!!!!
Sorry about that. It's google ads and often there are some incredibly bad advertisers who manage to get on the site. When I see 'em, I ban 'em, but they show up at random.
It's just to help pay for the site costs, so don't take some sexist ad seriously and please do use the contact form so I can catch 'em and then ban 'em.
Unfortunately Google is not picky enough on advertisers.
even there I'm wanting things to be based on verified stats and theory almost exclusively. The numbers speak for themselves as does the theory.
It sure would be a lot easier to take the columns in your web site seriously if I didn't have to view a reclining woman in a tight tank top the whole time, even with trying to resize the screen. advertising a shirt, or wtf??? Jesus.
Politics has been so entangled in Economics for 160 years that Marx wrote the "Critique of Political Economy" to try to show the inseparability one from the other. No one has been able to separate History and Economics. Some call History "past politics". History is threaded into all the writings of Ricardo and Smith as well.
Good luck in purifying economics.
Are you serious?
Politics and Immigration are everywhere on EP and in news. Im talking elector politics,
outsourcing, immigration, H1Bs averywhere
"
n this site, I'm pretty much determined to stay out of the politics on this, it's such an insane topic and stick to labor econ. I'm also not going to deny that population, immigration does indeed affect labor markets
.
"
You have my sympathies Robert. Keep writing.
It's too large to be embedded, click here.
I have no verified any of these numbers.
in Federal Reserve private debt purchases to "help" the economy.
Krugman does an overview on what the Fed could do to "help" the economy, but frankly I still do not get, beyond buying up, reducing principle on consumer/residential mortgages that goes directly into debt relief for the middle class, how buying up worthless MBS and other securitized loans, which as far as I am aware, do not "trickle down" to the poor smuck (individual) who is stuck with the debt...helps "the economy".
This post has become popular on the Internets, so those reading it, give me a calculated answer on how buying more securitized derivatives, even MBS and consumer loans helps the economy for I don't see any of this helping the U.S. labor force, the U.S. middle class.
This is a classic, we have a Bankster representative, running against Carolyn Maloney because she dared to defend the Consumer Financial Protection Agency.
At least you know what you're voting for and they are pouring gobs of money into this primary. I always thought instead of Democrat/Republican, Congressional and Senate seats should be marked, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan Chase, Oracle, Microsoft and so on.
The resume is our classic point by point Wall Street agenda. Three Hedge funds and spinning global labor arbitrage as discrimination to boot, so you can have your Wall Street nightmare and unlimited global labor arbitrage all in one!
Poor poor Wall Street, they have been so maligned! (sic)
Considering we cannot get corporate tax code changes to stop making it more profitable to offshore outsource jobs and production overseas, I completely agree with you. There is no doubt they would pass something for even more incentives to invest and create jobs overseas. This government is too corrupt to actually change the law or make investment in the U.S. more favorable. But I think claiming businesses are not re-investing because the economic outlook isn't too rosy (which is very true) is ignoring the recent history of these corporations hording cash for quarterly earnings and executive compensation.
But yeah, we cannot get this government to pass anything that's a change, even with a financial Armageddon under their belt.
Haven't heard from you for while so very glad to see your comment!
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